Full Discussion

Melissa Dayton:
Greetings,
Connecticut and Indiana are establishing workforce readiness certificates based on the CASAS Workforce Skills Certification System. Attached is a copy of the COABE presentation, "Workforce Skills Certificates: Enhancing Curriculum and Student Outcomes", which Dan Wann of the Indiana Adult Education Professional Development Project and I co-presented. The session generated many good questions, and we look forward to this week's discussion.

Melissa Dayton
Adult Training and Development Network
Capitol Region Education Council
111 Charter Oak Avenue
Hartford, CT 06106
tel: (860) 524-4057
fax: (860) 524-4050
www.crec.org/cetes/atdn

Moderator:
Thanks for sharing your materials, Melissa and Dan. Dan, I hope it is agreeable with you if we address questions to you too this week.

I notice in the Indiana portion of your presentation that the Indiana Workforce Education Project is (was) "industry driven" and that the main industries served were manufacturing, agriculture, hospitality/tourism, and transportation/logistics. How were these sectors targeted?

Another question: One of your slides says that "98 classes were held in 60 companies with 1,074 students" and that 232 of these were dislocated or unemployed workers. Were these workers being provided these classes by the companies they had previously worked for as some sort of a severance package? If not, where did they come from and were their classes also held on company premises?

And a question for all our discussants: Where does the funding for credentialing programs come from? Are they generally held in workplaces with cooperation from the company or are they usually pre-employment ventures?

Thanks in advance for helping us understand how this has worked for you.
Donna Brian, Moderator
Workplace Literacy Discussion List

Dan Wann:
I will try and answer your questions as best as I can. I have also asked Timmie Westfall who is the Workforce Literacy Education Project Director for Division of Adult Education, IDOE to join in this discussion. She was originally going to be on the panel with Melissa and myself but her schedule did not allow her to attend COABE this year.

1. Industry Driven-there are several factors that make this project industry driven. The Indiana Department of Workforce Development has a Strategic Skills Initiative and many of the industry sectors mentioned in the IN presentation are the same. Also, the company must ask for the class, and yes, we do market our services to business and industry. But the starting point and first customer is the business itself. They must be full partners in the class and have a representative that helps set goals for the class, participates in an advisory committee, and further all companies are expected to make a financial commitment to support the class and the employees who attend. A third and major factor that makes this project industry led is the emphasis on local needs and demands. As in all states there is a huge variety in business and industry from size of the company, product or services offered, and the make up the local workforce. The needs of northwest Indiana near Chicago are vastly different from the more rural southeastern corner of the state that border Ohio and Kentucky.
2. Dislocated workers-the workers referred to on that slide represent those served in our program last year. We have been delivering Workplace Literacy Education since 2000 and usually have a similar proportion of dislocated workers. Most of these workers are receiving both state and company assistance in re-training efforts. In South Bend, IN the Workforce Literacy class was held at the WorkOne (One Stop) office with the goal of assisting the worker to bring skills up to a level to enter one of the more formal credentialing or training programs. At another location in Connersville, IN the class was held at the company with multiple partners providing a variety of training programs. Again the Adult Education class' primary goal is to help raise the basic skill level of the worker so they can meet entry criteria of the various training classes.
3. Funding-there is a variety of funding sources. The Workforce Literacy Project is a major initiative for the Division of Adult Education which supports the project with training and state staff as well as programming dollars. The companies also contribute to a degree. There are three regional Workforce Educational Specialists who assist business and local adult education programs in applying for grants from other state agencies for workforce development training funds when appropriate. It takes a lot of creativity and a combination of resources. At time the Workforce Education project is exploring a Fee for Service model.
4. Curriculum-while not asked this question here I am adding a comment. >From the beginning of the Workforce project in 2000 we have focused on a customized curriculum based on the workplace itself and the needs of the employees to function effectively on the job. While we may use some published materials, all teachers are trained and expected to go into the worksite, meet with employees and supervisors and then develop curricula materials and activities that utilize workplace documents. While this does lead back to the first question about being industry driven, it also provides a rich classroom experience for the working adult student.

Dan

Dan Wann
Professional Development Consultant
Indiana Adult Education Professional Development Project
dlwann at comcast.net

Moderator:
Dan's comment about one class being held at the One Stop office makes me wonder about the involvement of One Stops in general in the certificate programs. It seems like such a natural partnering. From the experience of our guests and others on the list, do One Stops take the lead in this adoption of credentialing programs? Do they at least support it? How does that work out in practice?
Donna Brian

Judy Titzel:
State workforce development systems, including one-stops, were one of the driving forces in the development of the National Work Readiness Credential. It was the workforce systems' -- particularly in NY, NJ and FL -- desire to more effectively address the needs of their clients (i.e. businesses) in providing workers with strong entry level skills that motivated those states to come together with NIFL to develop the National Work Readiness Credential. Currently, the NWRC Assessment is being delivered online through one-stops (among other venues) as the NWRC tests the delivery system before going public. It seems like a good fit.

Judy Titzel
Adult Education Specialist
Providence, RI

Moderator:
Workplace discussants,

If you have remaining questions or comments about work credentials, now is the time to submit them! This has been a very busy week for some of our guests, even before they agreed to monitor our discussion and contribute their thoughts, and some of their responses are still "in the pipeline". They have all joined the discussion list now, and may be available later for your questions, but it would still be better for us to focus the discussion today and through the weekend.

One question I would still like to know the answer to is, "Are the three major ways of assessing work readiness, CASAS, WorkKeys, and WRC credentials ever used to complement each other, or are they mutually exclusive?"

Thanks!

Donna

Dan Wann:
Donna,

In our case, Indiana, the department of workforce development elected to use WorkKeys as the Workforce Credential and that credential in Indiana is similar to the description that was given by the folks from Ohio.

The DWD was interested also in the incumbent workforce that appeared to be below the WorkKeys level 3 and developed a complimentary 3 level certification using CASAS. There were discussions at various levels and with different staff from both DWD and the Division of Adult Education prior to the direct consultation with DWD and CASAS. As our State Certified CASAS trainer I provided initial training on CASAS and then CASAS staff helped to finalize the final stages of the three level certificate based on the CASAS scale that could lead an incumbent worker onto the WorkKeys three level certificate.

To explore the need for training at the adult basic skills levels, The DWD sent out an RFP for workforce literacy training that targeted this lower level. Since that project has not completed its cycle, information on number of participants, levels, and outcomes is not yet available.

Several of the IDOE funded adult education programs are partners in the above mentioned grants that had to have an employer focus and the division of adult education also provided training and consultation services for the DWD project grantees.

I think that for the Basic Skills network and by that I mean those agencies the serve individuals who perform below a high school 12th grade level and are developing certificates or other types of recognition of skill advancement, need to consider how our system articulates with "cut score" or entry level skill level needed for a variety of other training programs from entry into post secondary education to other certification systems such as the MSSC certificate.

Dan Wann
Professional Development Consultant
Indiana Adult Education Professional Development Project

dlwann at comcast.net

Priscilla Carman:
Good morning all,
I have some questions about work readiness credentials for the various guests that may not pertain to the basics of the topic exactly but I would love to hear your thoughts at some point if you discuss the basics first.

1. As states, regions, local communities etc. make the many decisions regarding work credentials, does the local high school have a role in the discussions and if so, how? And how do employers weigh the value of a work credential vs. high school diploma or its equivalency?
2. It seems there are so many factors that must be deliberated at many levels (local and up) and I'm wondering how different states made their decisions about the scope of the credential and where decisions are made and finalized.

Any thoughts and words of wisdom you have to share would be greatly appreciated, especially by those states that are still exploring this whole inititative.

Best regards and thank you in advance! Priscilla Carman

Priscilla S. Carman
Literacy Specialist
Institute for the Study of Adult Literacy
The Pennsylvania State University
208F Rackley Building
University Park, PA 16802-3202
PH: 814-865-1049 FX: 814-863-6108

Louis Soares:
Priscilla,

My own experience working with education, workforce and business stakeholders in different states is that there are a myriad of approaches out there.

Some states are beginning their work readiness discussion in K-12, some in workforce and some in both.

Where the policy level discussion begins seems to have the greatest impact on which stakeholders in a state are the most active.

For example, in Missouri they developed a workplace essential curriculum in their K-12 system and the policy group is trying to figure out how it applies there first. Kentucky adult education distance learning initiatives are aligning their curricula to different credentials, The National Work Readiness Credential being one such example.

In Minnesota, there is a partnership of adult education and One Stop employer services looking at a range of tools to use but most likely will end up using a portfolio of solutions.

The business community in these states is involved to one degree or another but still is trying to figure out where states will land. A core challenge in this regard is that the immediate human capital needs of businesses sometimes take a back seat to the necessary public sector policy making process and business gets frustrated.

One good thought for public sector and non-profit professionals to keep in mind is that business currently uses a variety of tools in their HR recruitment and talent development process, and each company is different based on culture and business model, so the public sector shouldn't try for a one size fits all tool. It is not the reality of business. Rather we should make the available tools as easy to sustain in the marketplace as possible. Easy to sustain applied to recruitment as well as talent development in real time work situations.

For the NWRC in our area of entry level work skills, we believe that this is one of the benefits of the NWRC, its simple communication, interpersonal, decision-making and learning skills quartet are simple enough to be used in recruitment processes but also in coaching relationships with frontline managers.

Hope this helps.

Louis Soares
Executive Director
National Work Readiness Council
1615 H Street NW
Washington, DC 20062
Ph: 401-451-3982
email: louis.soares at workreadiness.com
website: www.workreadiness.com

Adrienne Glandon:
Good morning,

When we worked on the CRC field test in Ohio, the field testing was conducted through ABLE programs, local high schools were not directly involved. The credential is not intended as a replacement for the HS diploma or GED. Hopefully, the credential is something the student would attain while working toward a GED. Or, for example, if the student is a dislocated worker who already has a diploma or GED, the credential would help them to compete in the workforce.

To answer the other question, Ohio is currently engaged in discussions about going to scale with the CRC. In the previous government administration, the Governor's Workforce Policy Board had made recommendations for using WorkKeys. We now have a new Governor, so that is currently in flux. Ideally, the credential will be most effective if it's supported by the Governor. Ohio's Department of Education's ABLE strategic plan does however identify the CRC as a high priority.

Adrienne Glandon
The Ohio State University
Center on Education and Training for Employment
http://www.cete.org/
Phone: 614-688-3720
1-800-848-4815 ext. 8-3720
Fax: 614-688-3729

Sidna Holloway:
In reply to question one: I don't think work readiness credentials are designed to replace HS diplomas or the GED certificate. It is my understanding that the basic elements are (at least for the EFF WRC) are being integrated into school curriculum from kindergarten through twelfth grade. I can only speak about EFF: educators from students through administrators and beyond provided input, design, content, training and implementation of the final product in a variety of areas. My state is a charter member and it now uses EFF via the Dept of Labor which has implemented it at the one stop employment centers. It also must be pointed out that, while educators played a critical role, so did the US Dept of Labor and industry leaders and major corporations who were sincerely concerned about the quality of work skills of the entry level worker and cognizant of the needs of the industries and businesses who hire them. (Sadly, a HS diploma/GED credential does not necessarily certify work place literacy or work place skills). WRC focuses on the literacy standards needed to be successful in the work place as the HS diploma and GED focus on the literacy standards determined by the federal and respective states. I feel that WRC complements rather than competes with the HS diplomas/GED credential. I also feel that if a employer was considering two equally qualified candidates and one of them also held the WRC, that would be the candidate that got hired. The statement is based on what the WRC is. (See pre-discussion attachment).

SidnaAnn Holloway

Nadia:
Work skills programs and work certificates are entirely new subjects for me. I am glad that I subscribed to the discussion. I was very touched by the anecdotal information from the instructor and the students in one of the Work Certificate Programs. I think it was the one in Ohio.

I browsed through the nifl messages from the Workplace discussion list. I scrolled up and down from 404 and came across the CAELA information regarding the amount of foreign born employees who entered the job market in the 21st century.

I guess that what caught my attention the most was the insights regarding interaction between work and language skills. The different approaches described to help workers whose language competence requires improvement sound really interesting.

I have a question but I am not sure if I am on target with the nature of the discussion. While credentials enable workers to improve their self esteem and carry legal and professional value, they also seem to punish the workers that have not had the opportunity to participate in programs like the ones I read about.

The amount of Latino adult students captured in data as "waiting list", plus the statistical information forwarded by Jackie Taylor regarding gains in literacy skill across ethnicities and ages, makes me wonder if the certificates open a wider gap not only between documented and non documented workers, but also among American and foreign workers of all ethnicities?

I have the feeling that adult certification can potentially reproduce the same inequities derived from public education that it aims to rectify.

My questions must then be related to funding. Work skills certificates are expensive from the point of view of the employer. What percentage of the workers have access to work skills programs? And do certificates broaden the gap among workers in America?

We would benefit from knowing what research tells us about public education and what age is at the highest risk of needing future correction of inequities and lack of access to social, technical and cultural capital.

Nadia

Norma Rey-Alicea:
Good afternoon,

In the process of researching our paper on work readiness certificates, I had the opportunity to interview numerous stakeholders (e.g., employers, community college staff, certifying agents) to gauge the costs and benefits of such credentials. I wish that I had also had the opportunity to interview test-takers because--aside from "testimonials"--their perspective is not prominent enough in current documentation on this topic. It'd be very informative to learn more about how test takers heard about "x" certificate; what their experience was in earning one (particularly if it required skills training); and their take on if and to what extent employers value the credential. Clearly, it is crucial that these certificates have the buy-in of employers. All of the major models emphasize the role that employer feedback has played in their development, promoting their certificates as demand-responsive, and therefore, more likely to be sustainable. Yet it also important that we do not lose sense of the "dual customer" concept here. For example, how would a low-income individual who walks into a One-Stop Center evaluate the currency of these certificates? What would she think of how current programs train students or provide referral services with the goal of helping her to earn a credential?

I also discovered in my research that, in general, we need more data to answer some of the tough questions that have been asked in this forum, including whether these certificates broaden the gap among U.S. workers by potentially reproducing the same inequities found in our educational system. Without more data on how effective these certificates are in increasing hiring potential and earnings, increasing job retention, and fostering advancement, we will have insufficient information to analyze any gaps or improvements they can create in the stability of our workforce. Given that a postsecondary education is becoming increasingly necessary to earn a family-sustaining income, the spokespeople for these credentials must be able to make the case--with numbers--for how these credentials "fit" at a time when being "work ready" not only encompasses having a certain level of math and communications skills, but also knowing how to send an email, for example. The nature of many jobs is changing due to technology and the "digital divide" is well-documented along class and racial lines. Developers of these credentials have many issues to consider, including the dynamic nature of our country's demographics and industries.

I find the language associated with these credentials fascinating. The categorization "work ready" itself is problematic in many ways because it can represent different sets and levels of skills that are often industry specific or geographically bound. One can be "work ready" in one field, but not in another. For this reason, certificates like the National Work Readiness Credential state that they are intended for people seeking a credential that documents their readiness for entry-level work.

None of the models claim that their certificate is meant to replace a high school diploma or GED. One could see them as a rapid turn-around credential, which is especially beneficial for low-income people who may not have the time or the circumstances conducive to going back to school and earning a high school diploma or GED (e.g., due to financial barriers, family obligations, lack of support services such as child care and transportation, etc.). One could also see them as complementary to a high school diploma or equivalency, as mentioned in one of our postings. Yet others view any comparison as apples to oranges, arguing that the typical high school curricula does not sufficiently teach "employability" skills and that these credentials can capture soft skills in addition to those we consider more "academic" in nature. As our report described, employers in all sectors highly value soft skills (e.g., customer service, leadership, reliability including timeliness). It would be great to see how these kinds of credentials might influence things like high school curricula in better preparing our young people to compete in this global economy. . .

It is my hope that certifying agents ensure that these certificates do not become one more barrier to underserved individuals' ability to compete in the workforce by paying attention to issues of access and investment. Keeping the cost of training and test-taking at a minimum is obviously critical--and it often requires the close collaboration and investment of the public and private sectors. Language, as mentioned in Nadia's thoughtful posting, is an issue that some models are contemplating in their program design. Last year, the Work Certified Program of the WDB of the Treasure Coast was looking into possibly providing its comprehensive exam for certification in Spanish. Sections of the test for the National Work Readiness Credential allow the test taker to hear the questions being asked in addition to seeing them (Louis, please correct me here if inaccurate). KeyTrain's curriculum for WorkKeys and its three main tests are all available in Spanish (also correct me here if I'm mistaken). Making sure that certificate programs and testing are widely publicized and accessible in low-income communities through community-based organizations (often more frequented by underserved people than One-Stops)is another approach to increasing access. If these credentialing programs want to help low-income, low-literate communities become more competitive in the workforce, they must be able to prove a return on investment with data. They should also work closely with the kinds of organizations that already serve these communities effectively.

Thank you all for sharing your thoughtful questions/comments and for giving me the opportunity to participate. Warm regards to Melissa and Louis, who helped me to explore this topic when I first learned about it!

Best,

Norma Rey-Alicea
Project Manager, Building Economic Opportunity Group
Jobs for the Future
88 Broad Street, 8th floor
Boston, MA 02110
Phone: 617.728.4446, ext. 196
Fax: 617.728.4857
Email: nreyalicea at jff.org
www.jff.org

Sidna Holloway:
Thank-you for such a comprehensive response. With your permission, I would very much like to forward it to my supervisor who is interested in the WRC. The population I work with consists of homeless veterans in early recovery. I strongly feel such a credential would greatly enhance their employability. I encourage all to keep in mind that the credential can be an asset in obtaining an entry level position providing promotion and career potential as opposed a dead end job disguised as 'entry level."

Best Regards

Sidna Holloway

Paul Jurmo:
Hi, Everyone,

Here are a few more (tardy) comments for the discussion on work readiness certification:

1. A work readiness credential should:
   • not be an "add-on," but an information tool to be used in a well-designed and well-supported system that integrates workforce development and adult education;
   • be based on a well-researched understanding of the skills and knowledge needed to get and succeed in a range of entry-level jobs;
   • be widely disseminated (through professional development and other means) to all stakeholders (adult educators, workforce development specialists, employers, labor unions, community groups, K-12 schools, etc.), so they all understand and use it in their respective roles in the workforce system;
   • be tied to education systems (e.g., relevant curricula, well-supported practitioners) for job-seekers and incumbent workers that can help workers develop the skills and knowledge identified in the assessment.
2. Putting such a system in place is a big undertaking. Researchers and policy analysts have been talking about the need for building well-integrated state workforce development systems for at least a decade, but this requires well-informed and strong leadership and an infrastructure of well-prepared and -supported staff to put the pieces together. Even when local stakeholders are willing to think outside the box, break down old silos, and try new ways of doing things, they need support (tools, guidance) to do so.
3. Given the huge financial strains our state governments, communities, and employers and labor unions are now under, we need to "work smarter" and find ways to build these systems efficiently, build on what has already been done and learned in the field, and avoid reinventing the wheel. Thus, those who are trying to build state systems need to share best practices across states and advocate for support for effective systems from the national level (of both government and business and labor)). I think this on-line discussion and the recent workforce pre-conference day at the COABE conference are good examples of such communications. I also look forward to reading the review of work readiness credentials mentioned by the Jobs for the Future representative.
4. The non-credit division of our community college is trying to put together a county-level workforce development initiative. Assessment (of both individuals and employer workforce needs) and relevant curricula will be key components of such a system. We look forward to learning from what others are doing around the country (and world) on these issues and will be happy to share what we learn.

Paul Jurmo, Ed.D.
Dean, Economic Development and Continuing Education
Union County College
12-24 West Jersey St.
Elizabeth, New Jersey 07202
908-659-5103
Jurmo at ucc.edu

Mary Lewis:
Hello, folks.

I "second" the comments of Paul Jurmo and in that vein add:

1. A concern about work readiness assessments that rely on written or reading skills beyond what's actually required on the job; I'd hate for tools to "underrank" jobseekers because their literacy levels aren't high enough for the assessment but are fine for the work they have been doing and even some work they could advance/move laterally into
2. A concern about work readiness assessments that rely on English language competency beyond what's actually required on the job by the job duties; again not wanting tools to be universally promoted that "underrank" jobseekers because certain aspects of English literacy are required for the assessment tool but aren't required for the work they have been doing and even some work they could advance/move laterally into

We see too many instances where English language skills are somewhat 'automatically' required without stopping to think about or define what aspect of English (read, write, speak, understand) is actually needed or can be legally required, and to what degree of fluency. This unfortunately includes training classes intended for ELL folks but which are both designed to require pretty high English functioning as well as advertised only in English, with the belief that if someone can't read the flyer their English isn't sufficient enough for the training.

With the workforce issues in the US, I would not like to see 'work readiness creditional' requirements developed without thoughtful and legal attention to the issues of English language fluency.

Thanks for your attention. And if there are models out there which have or are successfully addressing or trying to address my concerns, I'd love to get contact information for them.

Mary Lewis
Monitor Advocate for Farmworker Services
Oregon Employment Department
875 Union Street NE
Salem, OR 97311
(503) 947-1220
Mary.L.Lewis at state.or.us

Susan Reid:
Hi Mary
You and others might be interested in the sort of analysis we have done for some job roles

http://www.workbase.org.nz/Article.aspx?ID=418

We are hoping to add to this list

Regards
Susan Reid
Manager, Learning and Development
Workbase: The New Zealand Centre for Workforce Literacy Development
2 Vermont Street, Ponsonby - PO Box 56571, Dominion Road, Auckland 1030
Phone: 09 361 3800 - Fax: 09 376 3700
Website: www.workbase.org.nz - Email: sreid at workbase.org.nz
See New Zealand Literacy Portal
www.nzliteracyportal.org.nz

Donna Weitz:
Hello,
The discussions are very interesting and thought provoking. Thank you. Can you please tell me what ELL stands for? Thanks.

Donna Weitz
Senior Program Planner
Labour Force Development Branch
Alberta Employment, Immigration and Industry
6th Floor, Centre West
10035 - 108 Street
Edmonton AB T5J 3E1
780 422-6831

Laurie Sheridan:
It stands for "English Language Learner" or "Learners."
To me this provides a good reason for us to try to avoid acronyms!
Laurie Sheridan

Dan Wann:
ELL--English Language Learner (refers to the student)
ESL-- English as Second Language (refers more to the program)
ENL--English as a New Language
L1--native or first language
L2--language other than L1 (many people speak several languages)

Just part of the alphabet soup, I hope this helps.

Dan Wann

Tommy McDonell:
Who does ENL refer to?

Tommy B. McDonell, Ph.D.
Adjunct Assistant Professor
Multilingual Multicultural Studies
Steinhardt School of Education
New York University
239 Greene Street, 6th Floor
New York, NY 10003

Home: 212-929-6768
Work: 212-242-6800 x 152
Cell: 917-514-1354
Email: tbr202 at nyu.edu

Dan Wann:
ENL can refer to the student. Sometimes the student is multilingual and is just beginning to learn English while another student is a monolingual speaker who is also just beginning to learn English. The term was developed because some in the field wanted to recognize those students studying English may have already learned a second or foreign language and had some knowledge and skill in second language acquisition. The term has also been used to describe the program especially in the K-12 arena.

Dan Wann

Donna Weitz:
Thanks very much. We've used ESL for decades; however we're now being told to convert everything to "English as an additional language" - EAL. Interesting. One more in the soup.

Regards,
Donna Weitz

Moderator:
Workplace Literacy Discussion List Members,

I want to thank all who participated in this discussion on work/career readiness certificates/credentials, both by discussing and asking questions on the list and by following the discussion as a reader. I hope you enjoyed it.

Special thanks to our guests, Norma Rey-Alicea, Geri Scott, Traci Lepicki, Adrienne Glandon, Louis Soares, Lanse Davis, Judy Titzel, Jane Eguez, Melissa Dayton, and Dan Wann. This was a busy week for many of them, and they were gracious in agreeing to follow the discussion and contribute their thoughts and experiences for our benefit. There may still be some posts coming from some of them as they have more time to read and think.

There may yet be more questions in your minds too, and it is fine if the discussion continues after the scheduled time slot. We have lots of people on the list with pertinent experience, and several of the guests are now on the list and may be inclined to continue as list contributors during any further discussion.

There are other discussions scheduled in April on other lists that will interest some of you. (See workplace post #691.) I especially want to remind you of the discussion beginning Monday on issues related to adult ESL and workplace education. To subscribe, go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Englishlanguage

Good Day/Evening!

Donna

Donna Brian, Moderator
Workplace Literacy Discussion List
Center for Literacy Studies at The University of Tennessee
djgbrian at utk.edu