Return-Path: <nifl-aalpd@literacy.nifl.gov> Received: from literacy (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by literacy.nifl.gov (8.10.2/8.10.2) with SMTP id i1IEGHI18562; Wed, 18 Feb 2004 09:16:17 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 09:16:17 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <003a01c3f629$747c96c0$0b00a8c0@DDQPYT21> Errors-To: listowner@literacy.nifl.gov Reply-To: nifl-aalpd@literacy.nifl.gov Originator: nifl-aalpd@literacy.nifl.gov Sender: nifl-aalpd@literacy.nifl.gov Precedence: bulk From: "Art LaChance" <arthur@ellijay.com> To: Multiple recipients of list <nifl-aalpd@literacy.nifl.gov> Subject: [NIFL-AALPD:1054] Re: Light, not heat X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0c -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; Status: O Content-Length: 6254 Lines: 134 David, Tom, Andres, I hate to jump in here in the middle of this but........ I've discovered several things over the years. One being that even though a person may in fact have the structural/sensory capacity to "learn" there can be overwhelming contributing issues that confound the learning processes that most likely are not organic. The tie-breaker in 90% + of all situations I've seen in vocational rehab and in adult lit is the psychology of the student. Where is the "Emotional Literacy" (coined by Anthony Gabriel-New Orleans - on the NLA list several days ago) capacity of the student in relation to accomplishing the academic work required for remediation. That is the question. While the information processing equipment may in fact be well within the normal range and quite useable it may be derailed and rendered totally ineffective by a condition whose symptoms are eerily similar to those presented by PTSD, as indicated in the DSM IV. My thoughts are that the average adult literacy teacher has only a smattering of psychology training or awareness that they've achieved as part of mandated curriculum in college, IF there is a college credit or degree requirement for the job they're in. I would strongly suspect that should some investigative body take a good long hard look at the successful adult literacy classrooms and/or teachers they will find an inate ability to address this issue residing within those teachers and/or staff. The end result being to encourage the student to extend themselves into the unknown and risk the failure they are so sensitive towards. I'm not talking about the standard calling all teachers into an auditorium and passing out questionaires or an abbreviated telephone interview - I'm talking about real-life long term observations into the methodology utilized by those successful teachers IN the classroom, again over time. The PD that is being served up looks suspiciously like somebody's interpretation of somebody elses "research" that was accomplished through associating past and present known theories with some specific curriculum delivery - ad infinitum. And no viable conclusion yet, or we wouldn't be looking still. Nobody that I know of has approached the issue of examining deeply into the situations where a child or adult who's been informally OR formally diagnosed as LD etc, or any suggestions of same, has circumvented that "disability" and learned to read or write or do math. What we've done is pass it off as anecdotal and labeled it as probably a sad mistake by the professionals involved- assigned it a rationale and gone on with life - ahhh too bad. What is the underlying factor that provided the impetus for the student to break through that internal resistance and open up to the threat of failure thence to become successful doing what the role models in their life told them was impossible for them ? This is the key, this is the underlying factor, this is the turning point, in teaching and in learning. Curriculum style matters but it represents not a fraction of the impact of the internal emotional barriers set up by those who fear non-acceptance or failure. To recognize it and deal with it effectively in somebody else is critical. Big problem especially when most of us have difficulty recognizing who we are - really. Art Art LaChance Gilmer Learning Center Ellijay, GA ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Rosen" <djrosen@comcast.net> To: "Multiple recipients of list" <nifl-aalpd@literacy.nifl.gov> Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2004 7:49 AM Subject: [NIFL-AALPD:1050] Re: Light, not heat > Tom, > > Andres Muro has responded to my request with serious arguments and > citations. George Demetrion has added his own arguments and citations. > I, and perhaps others, would be interested to hear yours. If you > disagree with Andres and or George, what do you disagree with? Why? > What evidence do you have from theory or research? And please, on this > list, connect your arguments and evidence with recommendations for > professional development. > > Thanks. > > David > > David J. Rosen > djrosen@comcast.net > > On Saturday, February 14, 2004, at 09:31 PM, David Rosen wrote: > > > Andres and Tom, > > > > If you want me -- and very likely other NIFL-AALPD readers -- to pay > > attention to your arguments, please use reason and cite evidence. > > Abjure ad hominem arguments, sweeping generalizations, sarcasm, and > > shouting (capitalized words are considered shouting in the e-list > > environment.) > > > > Tom, concisely, what are your arguments, and what is your evidence, > > especially scientifically-based evidence which you may have for your > > arguments about reading and spelling as they apply to adults. What > > scientifically-based research on adults is the basis of your (and > > Robert Sweet's) arguments? Are you arguing, for example, that the > > reason that _all_ adults in America cannot read is that they did not > > have as children (and now as adults do not have) teachers who were > > well trained in phonics methods? (If not all? Then how many, what > > percent? What's your evidence?) > > > > Andres, are you saying that phonics-based approaches will not be of > > significant help to dyslexic adults who have difficulty decoding > > words, or are you saying that this is just one group of adults who > > have reading difficulty and that there are others? Lay it out for us. > > What are the various causes of adult reading difficulty? What's your > > evidence? > > > > And please, if you can, tell us what you think the implications of > > your arguments are for staff development, the focus of this list. How > > should we be "training" teachers of native English speaking adults who > > cannot read at all or who are reading at NALS Level 1 for example? > > Should the training be different for teachers of adults who are > > learning English, SPL 1-3, for example? What should teachers of > > adults know and be able to do to help adults who can read (who have > > decoding skills, some automaticity, and a fairly good vocabulary) but > > who cannot read well, or critically? > > > > Shed some light, please. > > > > Thanks, > > > > David J. Rosen > > djrosen@comcast,net > > >
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