Return-Path: <nifl-ld@literacy.nifl.gov> Received: from literacy (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by literacy.nifl.gov (8.10.2/8.10.2) with SMTP id g27Kg7u09430; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 15:42:07 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 7 Mar 2002 15:42:07 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <006201c1c617$90161bc0$1dd9c740@net> Errors-To: listowner@literacy.nifl.gov Reply-To: nifl-ld@literacy.nifl.gov Originator: nifl-ld@literacy.nifl.gov Sender: nifl-ld@literacy.nifl.gov Precedence: bulk From: "Sioux Falls Area Literacy Council" <sfliteracy@mcleodusa.net> To: Multiple recipients of list <nifl-ld@literacy.nifl.gov> Subject: [NIFL-LD:3935] Re: assessment of LD X-Listprocessor-Version: 6.0c -- ListProcessor by Anastasios Kotsikonas X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; Status: O Content-Length: 5815 Lines: 139 I agree!! And, might I add, my impression is too many folks make quick incorrect assumptions and then "do blame" when it isn't true! A couple more comments withing the paragraphs. Nancy Hansen Sioux Falls Area Literacy Council Sioux Falls, SD ----- Original Message ----- From: "Art LaChance" <arthur@ellijay.com> To: "Multiple recipients of list" <nifl-ld@literacy.nifl.gov> Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2002 7:02 AM Subject: [NIFL-LD:3929] Re: assessment of LD > Interesting that the diagnosis makes the assumption that the student was exposed to a perfect learning scenario delivered by a perfectly qualified teacher and because they didn't learn the material in this perfect situation they, the student, must be dysfunctional. ?? > > Am I the only one here who sees this? > > Art LaChance > Gilmer Learning Center > Ellijay, GA > > > Susan Jones wrote: > > > My comments are written beneath the paragraphs to which they apply. > > > > Susan Jones > > Academic Development Specialist > > Academic Development Center > > Parkland College > > Champaign, IL 61821 > > sujones@parkland.cc.il.us > > > > >>> anne.murr@DRAKE.EDU 03/05/02 06:32PM >>> > > > NIFL-LD Digest 1243 > > > > > >Topics covered in this issue include: > > > > > > 1) Re: Assessment Software for LDs/ foreign lang. > > > by "Susan Jones" <sujones@parkland.edu> > > > 2) Re: Assessment Software for LDs/ foreign lang. > > > by SAMM <Samm@seattlegoodwill.org> > > > > > >---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >I'd like to respond to Susan Jones' remark about the teacher who > > >"suspects this student, a recent immigrant from a country in Africa, > > >has learning disabilities". > > > > >How can we know a person has a learning disability without the > > >expensive diagnosis by a psychologist? The legal/formal definition > > >of LD is a discrepancy of at least one standard definition between IQ > > >and functioning in reading and/or math. The LD label does not inform > > >he educator about the nature or extent of the person's learning > > >difficulties. > > And from what *I've* heard in the past, just because a diagnosis of LD is determined it isn't going to necessarily show the methodology to change the outcome for the learner either. > > Correct. However, it would be very helpful to us if we could know whether the reason this student struggles with the sounds is a "typical" problem people have when switching languages, or whether these difficulties are signs of a problem processing those soudns. > > > > >We can easily identify if a person has a reading LD by asking him or > > >her to tell you the sounds that go with letters. If they are not > > >able to do this, they will not be able to read or spell well. > > > > Well, not in this case. Because reading is not her native language, she may not know the sounds that go with the letters because she doesn't know the language, not because of a problem with the process of making that association. > > PLUS ... in this student's case .... check the native tongue language FOR vowel sounds. Are there even? In Other Languages which do not have vowel sounds (specifically *short* vowel sounds) I have found that the ESOL learner can neither hear nor repeat that sound we attach to our vowels. This has also been true of English language speakers for us. > > >Thus, my "reductionist" view of learning disabilities: it is > > >estimated that at least 85% of persons with LD have a reading > > >problem. How do we identify the root cause of that reading problem? > > >The research from cognitive psychology is very clear that the basic > > >processing "glitch" which causes reading failure is that persons are > > >not able to perceive the sounds in words (phonemes), cannot connect > > >the sounds with the letters (poor phonological processing skills), > > >and therefore are unable to sound out words. Every person I see in > > >our Literacy Center (child and adult) who struggles with reading (and > > >even some fairly competent sight readers) cannot identify short vowel > > >sounds - and aren't very clear about long vowels either. > > > > Right. However, the above question still remains. Is there a processing "glitch" or is this a difficulty she would not be having in her native tongue? > > > > >As I understand it, learning disabilities are cognitive information > > >processing problems. The problem in a reading LD is that persons do > > >not process sounds in language efficiently. As Mary Lynn Carver > > >stated, the" Multi-Sensory Language Learning techniques like Wilson > > >or Orton/Gillingham or many others" which directly teach letters and > > >sounds and how they go together to make words, are successful in > > >directly addressing a reading "disability" without needing the > > >diagnosis of "Learning Disability". If they don't know the letters > > >and sounds, don't worry about the label. Teach them. > > > > In order to "teach them" best, knowing the nature of the problems is important. > > I've had some fairly extensive experience using structured, multisensory language programs with students with LDs. It's simply not as simple as "teach them." It's especially not as simple when she's not enrolled in a class that teaches those sound-symbol connections; she's enrolled in a college writing class. Her teacher wants to give her the best chance of succeeding at this class given the available resources. > > > > Sue Jones, webmastress > > http://www.resourceroom.net > > > > >Thoughtfully yours, > > > > Anne > > -- > > Anne Murr, Coordinator > > Adult Literacy Center > > School of Education > > Drake University > > 3206 University Ave. > > Des Moines, IA 50311 > > anne.murr@drake.edu > > Tel 515-271-3982 > > Fax 515-271-4544 > > >
This archive was generated by hypermail 2b30 : Fri Jan 17 2003 - 14:41:15 EST