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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>This has been a very interesting discussion.
However, some of us seem to forget that every clasroom is different. In my
experience, I haven't found that any one rule applies. To say that one should
never use children's books is just silly. It depends on the book and how you use
it, and it depends on the level of your class and their personalities and their
backgrounds, etc. Also, some of you must have the great luxury of teaching
students who are highly literate and have a lot of free time to go to the
library and get books. I teach workers in a hospital. We get four
hours a week. They all work two jobs. And they take care of families
and homes. They are exhausted. If they ever get a day off, they
don't head to the library. They sleep. If I want them to improve
their reading skills, I have to choose materials for them to read. And I
don't think I am some sort of literacy dictator when I do so. I do ask for their
imput, but some of them are low literacy in their own languages and don't know
what to ask for. We do lots of practical things (like forms and work
related materials and realia from daily life), but that does get a little dull
as a steady diet. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I am using a children's book (God forbid!)
tonight. It is "The Treasure." It's a beautiful folktale. I
have three different levels of readers in my class, so I have written out the
story with exercises at three different levels. We will work with this in
class. When they have finished the reading, I will then show them the
book. The language is not "babyish" and the pictures in the book are not,
either. I will present it as a work of art that both adults and children
enjoy. I always ask them if they enjoyed what we just read, or if
they would like to try something different. They have been my students for
two years now. They do tell me if they don't like something. They are not
in awe of me. I make plenty of mistakes, and I make sure they see them.
And I respect my students and they know it. They do know they can come and talk
to me about what we study, and they often do. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Enough with the children's book bashing. It
would be better to share they ways people have used them successfully as well as
mentioning when they have not worked--in a constructive manner.
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Just my two cents.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Pam Haran</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>ESL Instructor</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>AACA</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Boston</FONT></DIV>
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<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=carolkubota@comcast.net
href="mailto:carolkubota@comcast.net">carolkubota@comcast.net</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=englishlanguage@nifl.gov
href="mailto:englishlanguage@nifl.gov">The Adult English Language Learners
Discussion List</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, December 04, 2008 9:13
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> [EnglishLanguage 3234] Re: I
don't understand the current thinkingbehind teaching reading to adults!</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>This discussion has been quite interesting. I appreciate everyone's views
on teaching reading in the Adult ESL classroom. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>My personal experience has been that adults do not really like reading
children's books in the classroom. Many of our children's books have the
same moral lessons that our students read in their own language. I have also
found that men do not like to read children's books.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>My students have asked to read magazines and newspapers. There are quite
a few of these resources available. The newspapers are written for ESL
Adult students. They include events that are happening now. The newspapers
also include editorials, crossword puzzles and comics My students really enjoy
reading these articles and discussing them with their peers.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>I have added a couple of links about using newspapers and magazines in
the classroom.</DIV>
<DIV><A
href="http://www.ericdigests.org/pre-9216/esl.htm">http://www.ericdigests.org/pre-9216/esl.htm</A></DIV>
<DIV><A
href="http://iteslj.org/Techniques/Krajka-OnlineNews.html">http://iteslj.org/Techniques/Krajka-OnlineNews.html</A></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>This is my personal experience. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV class=signature id=signature>--<BR>Director/Language and Culture
Specialist <BR>Battle Creek Language and Culture Center <BR>7 Heritage Oak
Lane #4 <BR>Battle Creek, Mi 49015 <BR>269-979-8432
<BR>http://www.bclanguageculture.com <BR>carolkubota@comcast.net</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
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Original message -------------- <BR>From: Tom Zurinskas
<truespel@hotmail.com> <BR>
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Someone said here: "I have the opinion that reading and writing need to be
connected."<BR> <BR>This was tested for thousands of k-1 kids in the
80's. The method was IBM's "writing to read" program using PC Jr's
(remember them?). The theory is that someone must write before another
can read. Why not teach writing along with reading at the same
time. The k-1 kids used keyboards even before they knew how to use
cursive.<BR> <BR>The writing to read system was phonetic.
The kids need to learn to spell only the 40 sounds of US English to spell
anything in English. Then they transitioned to traditional spelling
after phonetic spelling. The book "Writing to Read" by Dr. John Henry
Martin and Ardy Friedberg documents the method. It worked very
well. Kids were far ahead of their peers in reading and writing
But it was expensive, requiring new computers. There also were
some special phonetic symbols in volved . Not so good.
<BR> <BR>Today the same methodology can be done for free using truespel
phonetic spelling. It uses no special symbols, just letters, thus
it's email friendly. I believe that experiment should be replicated
using the free truespel converter at truespel.com to generate text and
phonetic lessons. The result will be that finally there is a way
phonetics can reasonably be used in the kids classrooms. And it can be
integrated with pronunciation and translation guides. This would be a
first. <BR><BR>Tom Zurinskas, USA - CT20, TN3, NJ33, FL5+ <BR>Learn
truespel in 15 minutes at <A href="http://tinypaste.com/764f4"
target=_blank><SPAN class=yshortcuts id=lw_1228326516_2><FONT
color=#003399>http://tinypaste.com/764f4</FONT></SPAN></A><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>>
Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 11:02:26 -0800<BR>> From:
kolgin@glendale.edu<BR>> To: englishlanguage@nifl.gov<BR>> CC:
englishlanguage@nifl.gov<BR>> S ubject: [EnglishLanguage 3207] Re: I
don't understand the current thinking behind teaching reading to
adults!<BR>> <BR>> > Well, Ali congratulations. You've hit the nail
right on the head. In<BR>> Pearson's Reading in the Twentieth Century, he
comments on how "other<BR>> disciplines thought that the educationalists
had got it all wrong, and it<BR>> was time for another group to have
their say"(p.11). So, the<BR>> different disciplines took a crack at how
to read including the<BR>> linguists, psycolinguists,cognitive
psychologists, sociolinguists,<BR>> philosophers literary critics and
critical theorists. And then the US<BR>> Health Department (NICHD)and
religous right threw in their two cents. If<BR>> you go to an
International Reading Association Conference, you will find a<BR>>
hundred methods to reading all claiming to be a panacea. The problem
is<BR>> there is no size fits all when it comes to reading. In my
experience, I<BR>> hav e had the best result with shared reading (a form
of LEA) and<BR>> Literature Circles (higher levels). I have the opinion
that reading and<BR>> writing need to be connected. That is, they need to
be taught together<BR>> and not separately. Although the book's focus is
children,Beyond<BR>> Traditional Phonics: Research Discoveries and
Reading Instruction<BR>> (Moustafa, 1997)was an eye opener for
me.<BR>> Reading for adult;especially, low level educated adults has
become a deep<BR>> interest to many. Welcome to the club.<BR>> Kirk
Olgin<BR>> Glendale College<BR>> <BR>> Hello all.<BR>> > My
name is Ali Hesami, and I am currently a graduate student in the<BR>>
adult<BR>> > literacy program at Virginia Commonwealth University in
Richmond,<BR>> Virginia.<BR>> > I've been attending a class called
"Teaching Reading to Adults" as part<BR>> of<BR>> > my required
curriculum, and I have been wondering about the current<BR>> method
s<BR>> > used to teach reading to adults. It seems to me that the
teacher teach<BR>> adults just as they would teach children, often even
using research and<BR>> writing on teaching reading to children as
guidelines.<BR>> > While I understand the usefulness of phonics,
phonetics, etc. by<BR>> themselves,<BR>> > I firmly believe that an
adult can better benefit from learning to read<BR>> by<BR>> >
simply reading in a classroom environment, guided by teachers,
tutors,<BR>> etc.<BR>> > An adult in his or her 40s or even 50s
simply should not have to sit<BR>> through<BR>> > long sessions of
syllable by syllable instruction if all they desire id<BR>> to<BR>>
> be better able to communicate with others and better express
their<BR>> opinions<BR>> > about the world surrounding
them.<BR>> > I speak from experience here. I began learning English as
a 14 year old<BR>> in<BR>> > an international school in Ta nzania.
I placed into the 9th grade to<BR>> start;<BR>> > no one ever even
approached phonics, phonemes, etc. I read and listened,<BR>> all<BR>>
> the while guided by teachers who helped me with the material at hand.
I<BR>> became conversational in about three months or so, while I worked
on my<BR>> writing, also with guidance from my teachers. Conversely,
while in school<BR>> > in<BR>> > my native Tehran, Iran, I was
taught English in a similar manner as<BR>> here,<BR>> > and I spoke
a grand total of three phrases when I left Iran for<BR>>
Tanzania:<BR>> > Hello, Fine thank you, and Beg your pardon? I'm not
even joking here! I<BR>> admit as a 14 year old I had an advantage over
adults here, but I<BR>> can't<BR>> > help but wonder if what worked
for me would help adults much more than<BR>> playing word games and
reading children's books.<BR>> > Let's have them read material they
can identify with in so me way , and<BR>> keep<BR>> > them reading,
while slowly working on their writing skill alongside. Let<BR>> me know
any thoughts, ideas, criticisms, etc. It has been eating<BR>>
away<BR>> > at<BR>> > me for a few months now.<BR>> >
Thanks in advance,<BR>> > Ali Hesami<BR>> >
hesamiar@gmail.com<BR>> >
----------------------------------------------------<BR>> > National
Institute for Literacy<BR>> > Adult English Language Learners mailing
list<BR>> > EnglishLanguage@nifl.gov<BR>> > To unsubscribe or
change your subscription settings, please go to<BR>>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/englishlanguage<BR>> > Email
delivered to kolgin@glendale.edu<BR>> <BR>> <BR>> <BR>> <BR>>
<BR>> <BR>> <BR>>
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