This is a reply to Robb Scott's very interesting comments.? On one level, Robb, I would agree that the references to LD in the article do seem outdated.? Let me remind you, however, of the framework within which my work takes place.?? As I explained in my first posting, my work in identifying LD in ESOL learners shifted dramatically after I moved into the field of adult ESOL precisely because so many people in that field whom I was encountering jumped to the very outdated conclusion that failure to learn must equal LD.? I have previously documented requests from teachers or programs to test or otherwise evaluate learners that included statements such as, "She can't learn phonics. She must have LD."? or? "She has made no progress in learning for 2 years. She must have LD, "??? or my two favorites,: "We know that most of the non-literate learners in our programs have LD. What should we do to test them?"? or, " We know all of the struggling ESOL learners have LD.? How should we teach them?" 

As I pondered why it was teachers were coming to these conclusions, two important factors became apparent:? One: the teaching corps in adult ESOL typically has little to no training in teaching ESOL and has little to no idea of how language acquisition works.? Thus, as you point out, in more ideally framed ESOL settings, there would indeed be much more comprehensible input.? There would also be an understanding of errors being made, a better understanding of how to explain the way language works,? more emphasis on what was critical at the moment as opposed to teaching a worksheet or book that happened to be in the program.? Also, trained ESOL teachers naturally include the phonological skills that are, to my experience, a normal part of language teaching: ? Repeating sentences completely accurately--thereby paying attention to sound chunks--i.e. words and syllables; directly teaching syllables, stress, rhyme and rhythm of language.? These features are frequently missing in the instructional environments I have observed.?? 

Second, precisely the sort of Response-to-intervention- approach to teaching that is needed to address students who were not making progress was lacking in adult ESOL. ? Instead of making sure that all possible needs of the learner and possible confusions or weaknesses had been addressed, teachers continued to do the same thing over and over or expect the same result from the materials the learner couldn't understand.??  

Initially when I really began to formulate a different way of addressing the " Is it LD or not? " issue in adult ESOL, I taught the use of five simple questions aimed at getting at the core issues of LD:? Had the problem persisted despite COMPETENT intervention?? Did the learner exhibit a characteristic irregular profile of strengths and weaknesses in the classroom?? Outside of the classroom? Had all other possible causes for failure to learn been addressed?? And finally, was the failure to learn getting in the way of some life goal (i.e. a test or class or qualifying activity of some kind)?? 

However, I soon realized in the face of factor number one above that many of the teachers I was attempting to train had little idea about the other causes of failure ( cultural, educational, linguistic differences)? and that the lack of ESOL training made the question about competent instruction moot.? 

Thus to assure that critical factors would be addressed in a sort of RTI fashion,? I shifted to teaching explicitly about what could cause adult ESOL learners to fail and how to address these factors to prevent or reverse failure, very much in an RTI fashion. And, as I pointed out, that has worked extremely well--just as it has begun to show promising results in K-12.? But then why wouldn't it?? Paying attention to learners'? real problems and needs and meeting them in ways that are useful is just good teaching is it not?

As for the reference to "phonological approach"--the comment suggests you, as many, have still misunderstood the nature of what I have found is needed by many, but not all, learners. ? As with all the other factors, this issue had never arisen in all my years of ESL teaching-- and when I really reflected on that and discussed teaching with other ESL professionals and re-examined materials I had used for years, I realized that a) much of the higher level of phonological awareness needed to be competent at reading and speaking English was already implicit in good ESL teaching and b) assumptions are --words fail me here-- gigantic, humongous, Himalayan-- that learners in ESL already come with these skills intact.? 

However, extensive research in the field of foreign language learning difficulties indicated that one could be extremely competent in first language and still have enormous difficulty learning a new language-- and often that was because of fundamental weaknesses in basic phonological skills.? ? Second I learned through research that the lower the education, the less well developed these skills are.? As I noted in my post earlier today,? it is common in my observations and consultations to find that non-literate learners are started out on the alphabet and phonics, when in fact they have no clue how to isolate even big chunks of sound, like words, in sentences without some training.? Repeated studies have shown that non-literate learners trained in these basic skills --especially if it can happen in first language, but not exclusively-- acquire literacy--and language-- more effectively than those with no training.?? This is hardly special ed---this is basic language and literacy acquisition.? 

While comprehensible input is clearly essential to good language learning (and note in my previous posting how I caution that for non-literate learners this practice takes on a new meaning), history, the field of second language acquisition, and questions to the local ESOL program will tell you there are some who do not profit from it as expected.? One reason is that learners may not have phonological skills to support figuring out what it is they are hearing.?? 

While I understand very deeply how LD impacts learning ("REAL" LD if you will) and how hard it can be for the person struggling with it, I also know I have never met a student who could not learn--did not learn.?? That IS a special ed- approach--sadly one that is often missing in adult ESOL.?? Literally every week, I encounter someone who says, "Well, there are SOME students who are never going to make progress, aren't there?"??? That's when I have to go outside and breathe....

?I hope this helps you understand my approach to LD and what my work is all about.?? Robin?? 
 

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