As Ira said, I, too, don't want to appear to be rude especially to the
poster.  Ira mentioned issues that I, too, am extremely concerned about.
 While I certainly agree that it's important to keep time honored and
proven instructional strategies, I am increasingly concerned about our
meeting 21st century teaching skills and concepts, i.e.
Is learning time and space limited?
Are assessments of learning limited to traditional assessments or can
we assess learning in varied and effective ways?
Are educators fully utilizing the quality information available via the
Internet such as research abstracts, interactive teaching/learning
tools, social media, etc.
Those and other questions may be more appropriate for another
discussion, but I did want to express my sharing some of the concerns
Ira expressed.
 
 
 
Melinda M. Hefner
Director, Literacy Support Services

Basic Skills Department
Caldwell Community College and Technical Institute
2855 Hickory Blvd.
Hudson, North Carolina 28638
Office:  828.726.2245
FAX:    828.726.2266



>>> On 10/16/2009 at 6:49 pm, in message

<6cdf233d0910161549i5c785f8btaba80df84e933cac at mail.gmail.com>, Ira Socol
<irasocol at gmail.com> wrote:
I'm sorry, and I don't mean to sound rude, but there are a bunch of
"buzz
words" in "Education Coordinator"'s post that I think are troubling in
terms
of build literacy.

"Fluency" is one. Not that the idea is a problem, but I meet high
school
graduates every week, trained by fluency programs, who read "perfectly"
with
zero understanding. We have, I believe, mistaken a skill - reading ink
on
paper/reading print - for a purpose, accessing information.

"Write on demand" is another. Once again, skill mistaken for purpose.
Students need to know how to get their ideas into preservable form,
but
first and foremost they must know why they should be doing that. They
must
have reasons beyond the demands of schools.

While I'm there, why not a recipe? An instruction manual? Or create a
video
explaining how to do something? Why are we limiting the need to
communicate
to a few forms?

"that they get all the reading and writing skills they need at that
age" Oh
why is age a factor here. We do so much damage to our children with
this
"Prussian Model" of age-based instruction. Humans develop differently.
Students need scaffolding and instruction when they need it, not when
we
have planned to give it.

Finally, "research beyond Wikipedia or indeed beyond the Internet." I'm
not
really sure what is "beyond the internet." Surely, once people get out
of
the way of Google Books little will be. I can go online and look
through the
Hubble Telescope's lens or I can go online and read James Joyce's
journals.
I can read Jefferson's letters on UVA's Library Site or Madison's at
The
Library of Congress site. The British Library gives me access to
hundreds of
years of British newspapers, and almost all of my PhD research is via
texts
found (thankfully) online, because damn few copies remain of the
educational
technology manuals from the 1840s and 1850s.

Literacy is not a static thing for a static world. Yes, I understand
that is
how John Calvin saw it, and I also know that his influence remains
dominant
in much of American education. But if we are to actually make things
better,
I don't think we will get there by repeating the strategies that
produced a
nation with a 10% college graduation rate before "crazy ideas" began
to
infiltrate in the 1960s.

Ira Socol

Ira David Socol
Michigan State University College of Education
irasocol -at- gmail -dot- com
socolira -at- msu -dot- edu
http://speedchange.blogspot.com/
http://riverfoylepress.com/


On Fri, Oct 16, 2009 at 13:09, Education Coordinator
<edcoor at hrcmc.org>wrote:


> Hooray.  I have been saying for years with no one listening that a

person

> should already be ready to enter college -whether it is a Community

College

> or Harvard or MIT.  they, at the very least, should be able to read

with

>

 fluency and understanding, have a grasp of alll kinds of history, at
the

> very least, what came before what AND the ability to write, on

demand, a two

> to three page something, fiction, non-fiction, a poem, an essay,

-opinion

> piece..

> Money isn't the answer here - its demanding that in each grade -

starting

> with 1st that they get all the reading and writing skills they need

at that

> age.  I would also add the ability to research beyond Wikipedia or

indeed

> beyond the Internet.

> I'll shut up now.  I could go on for a long time.

> katie murdock

> Ed. Coor.

> Financial Education

>

> On Fri, Oct 16, 2009 at 9:11 AM, Nora Chahbazi <ooprc at comcast.net>

wrote:

>

>>  Dear Michael - and all,

>> Michael, I agree with you that this statement is just rhetoric (and

it

>> certainly sounds good; wish it could possible!) and is impossible,

even if

>> the perfect potential change happened - teachers were actually

taught how to

>> teach reading in colleges and students were actually taught how to

read in

>> school - it would take a lot longer than 2020 to reap the benefits. 

In the

>> Diploma to Nowhere Report released last year -

>> http://www.strongamericanschools.org/diploma-nowhere - it is

reported

>> that over $2 billion is spent yearly on remedial programs in

colleges, 1.3

>> million college students per year SEEK OUT remedial help including

43% of

>> students from 2 year colleges and 29% of students from 4 year

universities

>> (this does not include the students who choose to not ask for

remedial

>> help), and 80% of those seeking remediation had a high school GPA of

3.0 or

>> higher.  So, as for an answer to your question of what it means to

be a

>> college graduate even today: 'not much' would seem to suffice.  I

think we

>> would all agree that these statistics are alarming, to put it

mildly.

>> What can be done?  We must first, as a nation, admit the enormity

of

>> the problem, make a decision to institute sweeping reform and

overhaul both

>> the education system and colleges of education, and drop the

illusion of

>> change that has been cloaked in rhetoric as well as gluttonously and

blindly

>> throwing billions of dollars at the issue.  Illiteracy and education

are

>> both huge industries, with lots of sub industries surrounding them, 

and

>> lots of groups and businesses have benefitted hugely and stand to

>> benefit further from the deluge of dollars from the government up

for grabs

>> and thrown in their direction.  The availability of such extensive

amounts

>> of money without a clear plan practically begs to result in waste,

fraud,

>> and abuse with lots of corruption sprinkled in.   Our children (who

after

>> just a few years transition into undereducated adults) are

suffering, our

>> society is suffering, and we are going to pay dearly as a nation in

the not

>> too distant future if something significant is not done to change

the course

>> of this situation that has long been wildly careening out of

control.   We

>> should learn from the excesses of the auto companies and financial

>> industry...this can't go on forever without (further) dire

consequences!

>> Nora

>>

>>  Nora Chahbazi, President

>> EBLI Evidence-Based Literacy Instruction

>> Ounce of Prevention Reading Center

>> www.ebli.org

>> 810.732.4810

>> fax 810.732.0366

>>

>>

>> .

>>

>>  ------------------------------

>> *From:* technology-bounces at nifl.gov

[mailto:technology-bounces at nifl.gov]

>> *On Behalf Of *Michael Gyori

>> *Sent:* Friday, October 16, 2009 12:28 AM

>> *To:* The Technology and Distance Learning Discussion List

>> *Subject:* [Technology 2392] Re: The *new* GED & Tech

>>

>>  Greetings to all,

>>

>> The FAQ document states:

>>

>> President Obama recently asserted the need to graduate more high

school

>> students and to support their transition to postsecondary education

or

>> career training programs. “By 2020, America will once again have the

world’s

>> highest proportion of college graduates in the world.” (Address t

o
Joint

>> Session of Congress, February 24, 2009)

>>

>> Before that, by the end of the 2013-14 school year, all children

will be

>> reading at grade level, according to No Child Left Behind.

>>

>> I also wonder what it will mean to be a college graduate in 2020. 

I'm not

>> even sure what it means today.

>>

>> If 40% of all high school graduates, who have a high school

diploma,

>> cannot pass the G.E.D. test introduced in 2002, I really must wonder

what

>> any of this rhetoric really means, and whether teachers will be able

to

>> function with even more pressures on their plate.

>>

>> Why do I feel skeptical? After all, all we need to do is keep on

pushing

>> back the target dates...

>>

>> Michael

>>

>>

>> Michael A. Gyori

>>

>> Maui International Language School

>>

>> www.mauilanguage.com

>>

>>

>>  ------------------------------

>> *From:* Jason Keith Guard/AC/VCU <jkguard at vcu.edu>

>> *To:* The Technology and Distance Learning Discussion List <

>> technology at nifl.gov>

>> *Sent:* Thu, October 15, 2009 10:03:01 AM

>> *Subject:* [Technology 2389] Re: The *new* GED & Tech

>>

>> The FAQ document released today by the GED Testing Service says

that

>> Computer Based Testing (CBT) with the GED will be piloted in 2010. 

They

>> will also begin field testing test items that will fill gaps

between

>> conventional wisdom concerning college/career-readiness and the

current GED

>> 2002 test series.

>>

>> Thought on this? Will the test become more challenging? Will

instruction

>> need to integrate technology more seamlessly to adequately prepare

testers

>> for CBT? Will these development help expand GED credentialing or

will adult

>> learners be left behind by these developments?

>>

>> I look forward to the discussion. Here is the document.

>>

>>

>>

http://www.acenet.edu/Content/NavigationMenu/ged/National_Needs_Announcement_FAQs.pdf

>>

>> Jason Guard

>> GED Specialist

>> Virginia Adult Learning Resource Center

>> Virginia Commonwealth University

>> 3600 West Broad Street, Suite 669

>> Richmond, VA  23230-4930

>> Phone:  1-800-237-0178 or  804-827-2635

>> Virginia GED Helpline: 1-877-376-9433

>> eLearn Virginia: 1-888-589-9003

>> Fax:  804-828-7539

>> Email: jkguard at vcu.edu

>> Twitter: jkguard

>> www.valrc.org

>> www.GEDVA.com

>> www.elearnva.com

>>

>>

>>   *"Troy, Gail " <gtroy at nelson.k12.va.us>*

>> Sent by: technology-bounces at nifl.gov

>>

>> 10/14/2009 05:18 PM

>>   Please respond to

>> The Technology and Distance Learning Discussion List        <

>> technology at nifl.gov>

>>

>>    To

>> "The Technology and Distance Learning Discussion List" <

>> technology at nifl.gov>  cc

>>

>>  Subject

>> [Technology 2387] Re: The *new* GED & Tech

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>> I too wonder about that brief press release.

>>

>> I believe that adding a test on-line to show digital literacy could

be

>> done and would be a great idea.

>>

>> If the test is to be made more difficult, so that it is even more

>> difficult than obtaining a high school diploma, (as you noted now

40% of

>> graduating hs students could not pass) – ACE has a huge reality

problem .

>>

>> Gail Troy, M.Ed

>> Lead Teacher

>> Nelson County Adult GED

>>

>>

>> ------------------------------

>>

>> *From:* technology-bounces at nifl.gov

[mailto:technology-bounces at nifl.gov<technology-bounces at nifl.gov>]

>> *On Behalf Of *Jason Keith Guard/AC/VCU*

>> Sent:* Wednesday, October 14, 2009 1:42 PM*

>> To:* Technology at nifl.gov*

>> Subject:* [Technology 2386] The *new* GED & Tech

>>

>> The GED Testing Service recently announced an apparent change in

thinking

>> about the content, purpose, and possibly method of delivery of the

GED Test.

>> (See their press release here:  *

>>

http://www.acenet.edu/Content/NavigationMenu/ged/news/National_Needs_Alter_Plans_for_GED_5th_Edition_100809.pdf

>>

*<http://www.acenet.edu/Content/NavigationMenu/ged/news/National_Needs_Alter_Plans_for_GED_5th_Edition_100809.pdf>).

>>  Although roughly 40% percent of high school seniors cannot pass the


GED

>> test, the issue of the test's adequacy for certifying the skill

levels of

>> high school completers has long been at issue.

>>

>> The press release describes the new GED as "a new, more

comprehensive

>> assessment program."  Two common areas of high school experience

not

>> addressed by the GED test are computer and digital literacy.  My

questions

>> depends on your interpretation of the GED Testing Service

announcement,

>> because some there appears to be a shift taking place regarding the

GED.

>> Should the new test be administered using computers? Should

technology be

>> added to the GED as a content area?  Would these changes help GEDTS

frame

>> the GED as gateway to college?  Would a more sophisticated GED test

leave

>> too many people behind who would otherwise have been able to pass

the test?

>>

>> Thanks for your consideration.  I look forward to sharing our

respective

>> speculation.

>>

>> Jason Guard

>> GED Specialist

>> Virginia Adult Learning Resource Center

>> Virginia Commonwealth University

>> 3600 West Broad Street, Suite 669

>> Richmond, VA  23230-4930

>> Phone:  1-800-237-0178 or  804-827-2635

>> Virginia GED Helpline: 1-877-376-9433

>> eLearn Virginia: 1-888-589-9003

>> Fax:  804-828-7539

>> Email: jkguard at vcu.edu

>> Twitter: jkguard*

>> **www.valrc.org**

>> **www.GEDVA.com**

>>

**www.elearnva.com*----------------------------------------------------

>> National Institute for Literacy

>> Technology and Distance Learning mailing list

>> Technology at nifl.gov

>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to

>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/technology

>> Email delivered to jkguard at vcu.edu

>>

>>

>> ----------------------------------------------------

>> National Institute for Literacy

>> Technology and Distance Learning mailing list

>> Technology at nifl.gov

>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to

>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/technology

>> Email delivered to edcoor at hrcmc.org

>>

>

>

> ----------------------------------------------------

> National Institute for Literacy

> Technology and Distance Learning mailing list

> Technology at nifl.gov

> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to

> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/technology

> Email delivered to irasocol at gmail.com

>

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/technology/attachments/20091021/2149859c/attachment-0001.html